, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Thank you, Adam. We're into our meat and drink here, as we enter the final 10 minutes. This is great. Before I come to James, who is going to look at some aspects of primary and subordinate legislation and framework issues with Bills and so on, let me just…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Yes. Great. Thank you. Adam.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Adam, I'm going to come to you in a moment, just for anything that you want to add in terms of legislative consent, because we've covered it in some detail, but you might have something to add. But before I do, I just want to ask one key question here on the…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Great. James.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
You're not relying too much on them?
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
And what's your response—before I pass to James—to the wider concerns that are still out there, including from environmental non-governmental organisations, for example, within Wales, about the wider impacts, not just within competence, but the wider impact…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Are there any limitations in the approach you're taking—you have constraints through resources, constraints through—? Is there anything holding you back from applying a forensic analysis to this? Not just what's been presented to you, but you doing your own…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Are there any limitations on—? Sorry, I'm not sure whether to address this to you or to the Counsel General.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Just to flesh this out a little bit, we're a little bit worried that we might not be taking as proactive a step, particularly after, as you’ve described it, the Blitzkrieg approach has gone, and then we take a step backwards. But we still have to do the…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Beyond devolved competence?
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Within devolved competence.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
But there's a temptation there to step back and go 'Whew, that's over. We'll sit back'.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Okay. Thanks, Alun. We're going to move on to the issues relating to the Retained EU Law (Revocation and Reform) Act 2023, which itself has been very much a moving feast as well, with lots of changes, even in recent weeks there. I've just returned now from…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Yes.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Thank you for that. Alun, you're happy that we've covered questions that we wanted to on that issue of UKIMA, yes?
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Regardless of the effectiveness of the policy?
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Would you accept that we need to draw a clear definition between the issue of competence and the issue of the practical delivery of policies that are decided within Wales, through Welsh legislation and Welsh policy frameworks, and how UKIMA bites on it?…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
That would be really helpful. Thank you very much. Let's move on to another area, which is UKIMA, the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020. We won't spend too long on this, but can I just draw your attention to the written statement of 18 August, where you…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Okay. I think we've probably gone as deep as we want to go there for now. We might write to you on some of these areas with some follow-up questions as well. You mentioned a letter there. I wonder, if it is possible, whether you could consider sharing it with…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
James, let me come to you for a final question on this section.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
And the Minister did reflect, to be fair to her, that, in other areas, it did work.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Okay, thank you. Alun, and then I'll come back to James.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Right. And then, previously, we've been in the post-Brexit legislation period, which was not the ideal time to deal with these things in a calm—. I come back to my question: how do you resolve this issue? Does Welsh Government, Scottish Government and others…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Let me just push back a little bit, because Alun wants to come in, and then I'm going to bring James back in. If I accept what you're saying, which is that this is not the best time to look at that in the run up to a general election some time—
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
James, do you mind if I ask—? Counsel General, if the Sewel convention and the different interpretations of it and its non-functioning, as you've described it eloquently and several times, is the crux of the matter, how do you then resolve that? Is it the…
