, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
It tends to feed into budget setting and that aspect.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
All right. Okay. Fair enough. Thank you. I'll come to you now, Peter.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
So, is it an assumption, then, that that is the sort of peak, or is it still growing? These are the sort of questions, because, obviously, if it still grows, then your costs are going to grow.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Even if you just did a straight line and—
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
That doesn't compute somehow.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
So, just looking at the figures, from 2014 to 2023, children in care—. The figure in 2014 was 5,745; in 2023, 7,210, yet you've modelled on a constant.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
I'll bring Rhianon back in now. Thank you.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
And we appreciate that things change and that they are complex, so the more detail, and as—. Mike's catchphrase in this committee is, 'Show your workings', so there we are.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
We'll come on to that in a minute. I wanted to bring Mike in and then come back to Rhianon. We cut across her and I want her to have half her questions as well.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Okay. Peter, did you want to come in, or has that answered your question?
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
I think it is, but I wanted to understand, and obviously, when you have two sets of figures that don't add up within one document, it gives—
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Sorry, yes, on both—I've added the two together.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Sorry, Rhianon. That's the best part of £80 million between the bottom and the top, so I'd rather not just write. I'd like to try and get an answer.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
I'm going to go over to Rhianon. I think she's got some questions around some of the inconsistencies in the data that we've already had. Rhianon, over to you.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
So, Minister, you're happy that it's as accurate as it can be, given those complexities.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
We've looked a lot at the policy aspects during this, but this is the Finance Committee, so it would be remiss of us not to look at the finances. You've talked a lot about complexity of modelling and you've obviously come up with numbers. How confident are…
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Thank you. The RIA says that it attempts, and you've reiterated it there, 'to strike a balance between the level of detail, the effort required to capture new data, and the range of potential outcomes' and you explained that to us then. To what extent do you…
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
I'd like to move on to talk about the financial implications of the Bill. The RIA states that the overall key guiding principle for the economic assessment is proportionality. What does this mean in practical terms and how has this been applied in calculating…
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Mike.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Having worked, before entering politics, for profit-making, shareholding organisations, and for a non-profit and a mutual organisation, I know the cultures are very different. By transitioning or closing down and starting again, do you risk moving the one…
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Going back to something you said earlier about the larger businesses potentially being highly leveraged, and you're talking about assets and assets might have large mortgages against them, and that element, by going down this path, what does that transition…
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Thank you. Peter.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
Okay. I know that Mike and Peter want to come in. I'll bring Mike in.
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
So, it's a—
, Finance Committee
Health and Social Care (Wales) Bill: Evidence session
So, you're not eliminating profit; you're just reusing profit into reinvestment.
