Constitution, Justice and External Affairs Committee

Good morning and welcome.

Can I welcome everybody back to the Constitution, Justice and External Affairs Committee? The public items of the meeting are being broadcast live on Senedd.tv and a Record of Proceedings will be published in due course. This is a bilingual meeting, so simultaneous translation from Welsh to English is available. Before we proceed, can I ask if Members have any declarations of interest that they wish to put on the record? No. Okay.

We'll move on to item 2, which is correspondence. You'll see from the pack that we've got quite a bit of correspondence from over recess. I'm not going to suggest that we take those one by one, but there are a couple of items that I would like to highlight, starting with paper 6, which is a letter to the Secretary of State for Wales. So, if I can bring the clerk in just to update on that item?

Yes. So, as you can see in the papers, the committee has written to the Secretary of State to invite him to give evidence to the committee. As an update, we've had confirmation from his officials that he's pleased to give evidence, but they have asked if the session could take place after his first appearance before the Welsh Affairs Committee, which is scheduled to take place in early December. So, if Members are content, as clerks we can make the relevant arrangements for him to appear before the committee following that—perhaps in early January.

Okay. That's positive. The other paper I'd like to highlight is paper 10, which is 'Rewiring the State'. So, you can find that on page 16 in your pack. The Cabinet statement paper sets out plans for devolution within England, but says the UK Government will work with the Welsh Government and Welsh stakeholders to explore how the benefits of greater local empowerment could apply here in Wales. And, according to the Prime Minister, he and UK Ministers will work with the First Ministers and Governments of Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, and with local leaders, to explore how local empowerment could benefit the whole of the UK.

Now, if Members have had a chance to read that, there isn't a great deal of detail in there relating to Wales. I was going to suggest that we write to the new UK Prime Minister and ask if he's willing to come in and discuss what those priorities might look like in a Welsh context. We will see if we get a positive response, but I think that would be beneficial for committee. Does anybody have any comments on that item?

Just one. First of all, apologies for being slightly late, Chair. I thought it was an interesting document. You're quite right, it didn't appear to fully appreciate the devolved nations' aspect of things, in my view, but there were some interesting points that I think we could pick up with the Welsh Government about devolution within Wales to communities. I was particularly taken with the business rates suggestion, that local areas should be able to keep more of their own business rates. And I think there should be an opportunity for us to discuss and test the Welsh Government's thinking on some of those things, personally.

Okay. That will be a separate—

A separate piece of action, yes.

—letter. But if Members are happy, then, we can pick up both of those points going forward and I can bring the draft back or we can circulate via e-mail before that's sent off. Any other points on that item?

I have a number of question on this, starting with: what is the definition of 'good growth'? I think that's setting out quite a statement of intent without being clear on what that is.

So, yes, there were a number of other points. A lot of it is really around how this fits in a local perspective for Wales. But, particularly, I think, if we're looking at devolving to local government, it's the impact of how that will be effective when we already have lots of data on how unequal local government is. So, I think we need to look at it from that perspective. Is there a gendered lens to some of this work? Because if local government is mostly a particular type of person, how will that be reflective? One particular element was looking to the technical route for 16-year-olds, and control of the budget for 16 to 19-year-olds, but are there many younger people in local authorities who can help to make and scrutinise those decisions? If they're all going to be made by a lot of older people who are on local authorities, then that's not really going to reflect the real needs of young people. So, it's that kind of engagement, really, would be something I'd like to look at.

Diolch, Sarah. Yes, I think, certainly, more questions than answers at the moment, so something we'd want to explore further. If Members are happy with that, are there any other comments people would like to make on correspondence? No. Members are happy.

We'll move to item 3, and I propose, in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(ix), that committee resolves to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting in order to discuss matters relating to the internal business of the committee. Are Members content? Okay. Members are content. Diolch yn fawr.